Walking by Faith

January 1, 2011 By Leave a Comment
This last year God took me from my place of ‘comfort in religion’ and set me out in the ‘wilderness’ to teach me many valuable lessons. At the time I didn’t understand why he would want to take us out of a church and put us out here without one, but we prayed and fasted for direction and God was clear, walk by faith. Just like when Abraham was told to go…go where? God had a plan for Abraham. Then there was Jonah who was sent to Ninevah. Ninevah? A pagan colony? There’s no church there for Jonah to join. Jonah resisted, but God directed his steps to get him to where God wanted him to go. I also thought about Saul, who became Paul. God blinded him, healed his blindness, then asked him to preach, but he asked him to preach, Jesus! The very Messiah of those who Paul had persecuted.  I would imagine all these people wondered the same thing we did when God set us out in the wilderness, but God has been faithful.
I thought I knew what faith was, until He showed me that I had a very limited understanding of what faith really is. Did Peter know what real faith was before that day on the sea? When he jumped into the water, he had his lesson on faith. 
{Hebrews 11: 1} Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
If I know where the stepping stone is, if I can see it, I can step on it…but that wouldn’t be faith. Faith is stepping out where there is no place to step, the invisible place. During this year of walking in the wilderness, God revealed many things to us and I will begin to share these things with all of you.
This part of our walkabout with God has been the most amazing adventure I have had in my relationship with God. As with any adventure there have been scary moments of walking on a tightrope and other moments of exhilaration like riding on a roller coaster. Yet, I will be praying about how to be careful with how I share this journey with you. Most likely you will feel some of those same feelings I felt as you read about the things he has taken us through. We have been through our own ‘fiery furnace’ like Shadrach and his brothers have. We have been in our own ‘lion’s den’ like Daniel. We have been in Esther’s position before a king who could ‘take our lives’. We have ‘walked on water’ like Peter, been ‘given sight’ like he gave to Paul, and had ‘revelations’ like John. I say all these things as metaphors of course, for we have not literal been in these positions, so please don’t misunderstand me and think I’m a lunatic.
The first part of my walkabout that I’m going to introduce to you is the place of being told, STOP! This big red stop sign was staring us in the face for a while as we pondered the direction God was taking us in. It wasn’t God putting the stop sign before us, it was fear that did that. Many years of being told what God’s will for our lives was, is what put this sign up. A preacher would tell us time and time again that he knew God’s will and it was to be in his church. When God began telling us it was time to leave, we didn’t understand. But we knew we had to obey and we were so deeply compelled to obey the voice of God over the voice of man who says he is ‘the voice of God to the people’. Stop. Stop. Stop. Why? Why say stop, if God is saying go? So who was right to obey? A man or God? We chose to walk by faith and go as God was guiding us.

stop sign by sisterlisa, on Pix-O-Sphere

Part of this journey also involved being told we couldn’t read about what other churches believed. We were told by a leader what he thought the churches believed and we were to believe him and not look into it ourselves. God was guiding us to discover what each of the churches believed and as we walked through our studies with God’s Spirit as our Teacher, we discovered why so many ‘leaders’ resist their congregations from learning these things. They disagreed with each other..the leaders of these churches..and that part we knew, but what we didn’t know specifically was which things were of such sharp division. 
As we furthered our studies we found that many other churches also disagreed with the teaching from where we were at before. So we went to God and asked which teaching was true. He has unraveled us from many man made teachings and false interpretations and it was been quite a journey.
What I would like to share with all of you is what we discovered about various teachings in multiple denominations of the Christian sects. What I will share with you will be what each denomination has to say about many particular topics and set them here so you can see the parallel and comparison of what they believe so you can decide for yourselves. I won’t tell you what to believe, but I will share with you a variety of things to ponder and seek the Lord about. The results I share with you will be startling to some and to others it may not be any surprise at all. One thing is for certain, this journey I share with you takes a mature faith in Christ. If your beliefs are based on your religious forefather’s interpretations and you have built your faith on those things, then you will discover what I discovered. My faith was not on Christ alone, Sola Christo. My faith was on interpretations and dictations of a religious forefather.
When God showed me how to get truly anchored in Christ, then looking at these various interpretations did not cause me to falter. I had no fear. I knew that my salvation was not contingent upon interpretations or education of theology. My salvation was on Christ alone. He holds us firm in him.
I hope you will join me this year for this exciting adventure. Happy New Year!


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Filed Under: Grace, Organic Church

No Comparison

December 22, 2010 By 1 Comment

Guest: Amy The Free

I was thinking about how diverse a snowflake is… how each one is so incredibly beautiful and different from another…. they are one of those things that you simply cannot compare, you know? I have never heard one person say, “I like this… snowflake better then this one… or let’s compare these two and see which one is more beautiful.” Not ever! You cannot compare, because each truely holds it’s own unique beauty ;) Same goes with the masterpiece of God… you can’t compare one person to the next… it’s not possible!
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Leaving a Church

December 10, 2010 By 3 Comments

If you’ve been in any church for a great length of time and have felt the need to leave, it is never an easy decision. If you have deeply invested your heart in the lives of the people and they have done the same with you, it makes it all the more difficult. I watched a documentary of how the Amish operate their Ordnungs  and the reasons why they excommunicate and shun those they feel are in ‘rebellion’ to their bishops. This is not an isolated practice. Many different churches function in similar ways and in varying degrees. 
A person may feel they have come to a place in their studies where they feel that they are in such deep disagreement that they can no longer attend that church. Other people leave because of abuse of authority and others may leave because there were deeper issues such as a pastor having an affair or is being dishonest with the government and the people about their finances. People leave churches for various reasons.
Of all the people I have spoken to about why they left church and how they did so, I have yet to find anyone who was able to respectfully part ways in love. Most times they left, because there was wounded hearts that couldn’t mend easily.
I have seen people slip out quietly by missing churches services every now and then and gradually missing more often until they just aren’t there anymore. If the church is a very busy church they may not even notice these families missing for quite a while. Then, when they do finally notice and they decide to go by or call them, the ones who left are hurt that it took so long for them to notice. Then there are those who notice right away and keep calling them, when the ones who left don’t want the contact anymore and feel at odds with how to say how they feel without hurting the church members.
We have also spoken to those who felt that the right decision in leaving was to attempt the Matthew 18 approach by going to the leadership directly with their concerns. 
In this attempt they felt the leadership was refusing to assist or perhaps it’s the leadership in the wrong and they refuse to repent. This poses a tremendous problem, because their next option is to find more people to confront this leadership with them. Most church members don’t want to do that and if they do humbly agree to help, if the leadership still refuses then these members are obligated to go before the whole church about the matter. Many times this brings about a church split. This can be a terribly painful experience for the whole church and a split among friendships that took many years to forge. This kind of scenario is like a divorce and it hurts everyone in the process.
Since every church handles departures differently it is difficult to figure out just how to handle situations like these. Every church, its leadership, and how it functions vary so greatly. Many have asked, “How do you leave a church?” To which I ask, “How do you leave a marriage?” It’s difficult and painful no matter how it’s done.
Some feel it’s best to slip away quietly and others feel a firm approach is best for them, but always keep in mind that the whole church will feel the loss. The members who leave aren’t the only ones in pain.
Looking back on our departure from a place we invested our hearts in for over a decade, I have pondered what I wish could have happened. 
I wish they could have let us go with a blessing and no hard feelings for our disagreement. I wish they had not tried so hard to limit our contact with those we were closest to. I wish the people would not have condemned us and cursed us for leaving. I wish just one of our closest friends would have listened when we said who hurt us and how they hurt us. We didn’t want people to choose sides. We needed love and support. We wanted help with the situations we were in. We weren’t listened to, we were rebuked for speaking the truth no matter how loving we were. It became a big mess, and we never meant for it to be so. We all got broken hearts over it from the leaders, our friends, ourselves, but mostly…the children. Isn’t that how it always is? The children are always hurt the most.
We deeply love the people and we are reminded of how Paul and Barnabas parted ways.
Acts 15 36And after some days Paul said to Barnabas, “Let us return and visit the brothers in every city where we proclaimed the word of the Lord, and see how they are.” 37Now Barnabas wanted to take with them John called Mark. 38But Paul thought best not to take with them one who had withdrawn from them in Pamphylia and had not gone with them to the work. 39And there arose a sharp disagreement, so that they separated from each other. Barnabas took Mark with him and sailed away to Cyprus, 40but Paul chose Silas and departed, having been commended by the brothers to the grace of the Lord. 41And he went through Syria and Cilicia, strengthening the churches.
Sometimes the contention just happens and there isn’t anything we can do to make it different. So here is what I’d like to share that I wish I had known when we left our former church.
It’s ok to disagree with the leadership about doctrine. Paul disagreed with Peter about doctrine and Paul spoke about it openly in front of Peter. I wouldn’t necessarily suggest anyone do this, but there is a time and place for it and it should be bathed in prayer beforehand. Seek the wisdom of others before doing so.
False teachers have been around for ages. You aren’t going to take down an entire denomination by just rebuking the pastor openly. The disciples told Jesus that they saw men casting out demons, but they sent them away since they didn’t know them.  Jesus told them not to do so. Sometimes it’s best to just walk away and say nothing. He also said that if a work is of God it will stand and if it is not of God it will fall. We can’t ‘right’ all that we think is ‘wrong’ with churches.
Attempting to be abrupt in disagreeing openly with a pastor will not only hurt the church members, but it will hurt your family as well. Some pastors will beckon for you to come before their elders before you ever get a chance to say something openly. In which case, you’ll probably be rebuked for disagreeing and you could possibly be disfellowshipped, excommunicated, shunned, or asked to leave quietly. It’s going to hurt, but graciously walk away in peace.
Maybe you feel the vision of the leadership is not the vision God has given you. Perhaps your pastor won’t listen to the vision God has given you. Maybe finding out where God would use your vision would be better than staying where His voice through you is not welcome. We’re all human and sometimes we don’t all always understand how God speaks to others. 
Maybe the problem is you and you may need to humble yourself and ask for forgiveness.
Sometimes you simply don’t know why you need to leave; you just feel a tug from the Lord to do so. 
No matter the reason, it’s not easy to leave a church.
It’s going to be painful.
This too shall pass.
I don’t know if telling people why you leave is important. Sometimes it’s just easier to say it is a preference and leave it at that. Sometimes it’s best to be open about why you’re leaving. Only you know the answer to that dilemma. God will guide you and any step you later feel was the wrong step, God’s grace has it covered. You’re not alone and you’re not the only one who has gone through this.
Just know this, God loves you deeply and you have the freedom to go where you feel God is leading you.
This was shared from not only my personal experience, but from testimonies of others who have left churches. It is not meant to be a cookie cutter approach on how to leave a church, but rather a simple testimonial from the experience of others who have been through this. I pray that even one small portion of this will help you in whatever decision your family needs to make.


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Filed Under: Healing, Legalism, Organic Church

Which is the Real Shepherd?

December 3, 2010 By 1 Comment
At first glance of this video, some might think it’s humorous, but what went on in my heart was sadness. The sheep represent the people, God’s people. God’s people, the sheep, are in need of honest, sincere, loving leaders who protect the flock, yet in this video you see their shepherds taking advantage of them for their own personal pleasure. They are using the sheep for their own entertainment. Shepherding them in and out of ridiculous circumstances instead of allowing them to graze and be at peace. These men have taken these sheep and are running them to and fro, for no purpose but their own. String them up with lights, run them ragged, send the dogs to make them obey, then stand back and laugh at what they have created, as if it glorifies some greater purpose. Just what we have in most modern churches today.

Does anyone have a video of a REAL shepherd?

In this next video we see a Border Collie named Bo who helps keep the sheep together and their shepherd is walking in their midst. He is among them and walking with them. My fourteen year old daughter watched with me then quietly said, “The dog is the Holy Spirit keeping them all close together and directing them.” A very realistic look at what is and what should be within The Church today.

Filed Under: Grace, Organic Church

Problems with Ministry Accountability

October 11, 2010 By Leave a Comment
When we began our journey of walking with God outside the institutional church (IC) we read many books about the natural movement of God in a fellowship. There are more books on the topic now and they use the term ‘organic’ to describe church life. Books that describe the paganism of the traditions in the IC’s have been written and blogged about many times over and that movement that was once fresh is becoming stale again. As natural and organic as people try to make church life, they are still wrapped up in the same rituals they just call it something different and meet in homes. You can leave the IC, but it takes a while for the IC to leave you.
I’m not going to come out and say anything negative about those books or the authors who wrote them and have huge blog followings. God used them to help our family and they teach powerful truths that can lead to freedom. However, I have noticed something and I even wrote to one such author about this and he replied in agreement with me. This ‘organic’ movement has caught the attention of misled pastors and they are trying to use the same lingo and format to keep people in churches. They are monopolizing on this movement just as several other pastors have over the centuries. When God is moving, those who don’t understand His natural moving and flowing through people, will try to mimic that movement, use the same lingo, and continue in their authoritarianism in the lives of the people. We are leery of this and have seen time and time again how people are kept in bondage to a system that is flawed and crumbling. So the question is asked and demands an answer..as the system comes down, what will the people do? How will they learn? Who will teach them? Where will they gather? Who will keep them organized? How will you ‘survive’ without a pastor?
There are plenty of books out there that already answer their questions and if I try to explain it here it would really be a waste of my time. No matter what author’s name is on the book, if you haven’t read them by now why would you take my word for it? I’m not going to try to convince anyone they need to leave their churches, or to ditch their pastors and church families. People have the freedom to worship where they want, with who they want, and study the Bible within the groups they choose. The problem I am seeing is that many pastors refuse to acknowledge that we truly have this freedom. 
Florence, Italy by marshacrist, on Pix-O-Sphere
Thankfully we live in a country where we have a Constitution that gives us this freedom and protects it. Sadly, I think if that law changed, the pastors would be the first to force church attendance on all the people. Now that’s scary. The very thing the reformers fled from, they actually brought with them. They were really no different that Constantine or King James. When they came to America they forced people to go to church, memorize their creeds, and pledge allegiance to their churches and their Bibles. Some protestants even burned women who didn’t go to church…by calling them witches and some of them were not witches. It is never a good thing to burn someone for not believing the same as you do, yet people get ‘burned’ all the time for just that.
Today we see preachers who label non-church attenders as apostate, rebellious, and even heretics. They practice their own style of persecution called excommunication or disfellowship, spread rumors of fear to keep their church members divided from those who go free and some even send spies out to make sure those who have left aren’t talking about their churches and if they are, they start up the persecution all over again. I’m not saying that all preachers and churches do this, but a great number of them do. They will deny they do these things so if you want to really to know if they do, talk to someone who was once a long time member who has left and ask them. If the leadership of the church frown upon you doing so, that’s your first red flag that they do.
But that’s not what I want to talk about today. If we think Christianity doesn’t have problems then we have a hole in our heads or buried deep in the sand of blindness. If you just really don’t see a problem with Christianity then be on your way because you won’t get what I am saying otherwise. Now some might call me a heretic already for talking about such things and that is fine, it wouldn’t be the first time. I actually take it as a compliment, so if someone wants to call me names like that then go right ahead, it’s your freedom to do so. Whereas they would despise it if I said the same about them and they’d try to cover it up, second red flag!
There is absolutely nothing we can do to keep control of the reputation of Christianity. It is wildly out of control and not thriving as many would like to think it is. So stop trying to protect the church’s reputation. You won’t be able to and it’s not your burden to bear. So the next question comes in,…has Sisterlisa and her family left God? I can’t help but to chuckle at that..if you follow my Facebook discussions or read my blogs at all, you’ll know that’s a silly question. But for the sake of the conversation and a tender ear to those asking, I have come to look at this from a different perspective and figure out why they would ask this question. Here’s what I came up with…they equate loving God with church attendance and serving in their churches. And maybe they think that there is no way for me to love God or serve Him outside the IC’s system. That is a false mindset, a stronghold, that keeps people slaved to the system. Now if you choose to stay there and are happy, then that’s fine, but please know that we don’t ‘need’ the system to love God or serve Him.
I don’t like to boast of the ways we serve God in our family, because I feel that is between us and God, but for the sake of the curiosity of my friends who think we need a church to do so I will share. God has given us a ministry that is different, but still just as needed in the world today. The ministry we are a part of is ordained by Christ, led by Christ, and we are accountable to Him. The next thing we’re ‘cautioned’ about is who are we accountable to? If Christ isn’t powerful enough to keep us in His plan, then no man will be able to, but I understand the question. I understand the question, because I recognize that we grow in fellowship and among teachers. I fully believe in the need spoken of in Ephesians chapter 4 where Paul was specific that we need apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers. Some pastors will tell you that the only ‘position’ left is the pastor and the chapter shows us that this teaching is not true. He said specifically that these functions are needed until we are all in unity of the faith. They will claim that we need evangelists, but in today’s culture the evangelists are just pastors who travel and help support the pastor’s teachings. In addition to that they only approve of a teacher if the pastor controls what is taught. Not only is this belief not found in the Bible, but it leaves the pastors without the kind of ‘accountability’ they insist my family needs. So who teaches the pastor?
So back to the question of who we are in fellowship with for teaching. God promised us that his Spirit would be our Teacher and He would lead us into all truth, and He does. For anyone to deny that we can be taught and led by the Spirit only, has defied the very power and nature of Christ in us. Although we fully believe His Spirit is our primary teacher, we do glean from others who function in the gift of teaching. We read many of the same books that many of you read and we watch many of the same pastor’s YouTube videos that you watch. We have fellowship with local pastors and leadership gatherings just like many other pastors do. Just because we disagree with the IC system doesn’t mean that we ditched the functioning of those listed in Ephesians 4.
We do believe it is beneficial to learn from others and there comes a time when you take a transition from being a student only, to becoming a teacher/student. Many pastors feel that anyone who is not a pastor is to always be a student only, but that is not how God designed us. He did not design us all to remain students only. He has a purpose for each of us and as we grow, we grow up in Christ to be what He designed us to be and we aren’t meant to be cut-out cookies that look and act like the pastors and their wives. But I’ll talk about that another time.

Part 2 (coming soon)
How I serve God outside the IC.


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Filed Under: Inquisition, Legalism, Organic Church

Confirmation and Recommendations for Ministry

September 2, 2010 By Leave a Comment
2 Corinthians 3
Bible by sisterlisa, on Pix-O-SphereI have contemplated furthering my formal education of theology, but have not found one that I can agree with 100%. I studied formally for two years with Independent Baptist and informally with them for 15 years. Hearing most of their ‘greatest’ preachers and meeting many of them as well. I have studied many writings of various religious forefathers and many spiritual leaders of today. As I was contemplating these things and hearing the Lord out on the matter, He reminded me of what Paul said to the church at Corinth.
Did he need to keep commending themselves? Should he have continually boasted and forced his theology on the people? Should he have gotten them to write letters of recommendation for them?

1Are we beginning to commend ourselves again? Or do we need, as some do, letters of recommendation to you, or from you?

But Paul reminded them that THEY were their letters of recommendation. He said this because, what the Apostles taught the people, produced love within them toward God and toward one another. Everyone was a witness of what they could ‘see’ in their lives after the Apostles had came through their towns teaching the Gospel.


2You yourselves are our letter of recommendation, written on our hearts, to be known and read by all. 3And you show that you are a letter from Christ delivered by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

Their confidence was through Christ toward God. They weren’t boasting of themselves as many other religious leaders did, thinking they were something special because of letters from other Pharisees. Their sufficiency was in Christ. Many of the Jewish leaders were not going to write letters of recommendation for these Apostles of Christ. Christ himself made them competent to teach the new covenant, the covenant that gives life..not of the letter.


4Such is the confidence that we have through Christ toward God. 5Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming from us, but our sufficiency is from God, 6who has made us competent to be ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit. For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

He goes on to explain that the letter from Moses was a ministry of death, to show us our need for Christ. It was not meant to bring us close to God, but to point to Christ who would bring us into reconciliation to the Father. The ministry of the Spirit has far more glory than the ministry of Moses.


7Now if the ministry of death, carved in letters on stone, came with such glory that the Israelites could not gaze at Moses’ face because of its glory, which was being brought to an end, 8will not the ministry of the Spirit have even more glory?

The letter of Moses was to condemn to death. But the ministry of Christ brings LIFE and this new ministry surpasses that of Moses’ letter of death.


9For if there was glory in the ministry of condemnation, the ministry of righteousness must far exceed it in glory. 10Indeed, in this case, what once had glory has come to have no glory at all, because of the glory that surpasses it. 11For if what was being brought to an end came with glory, much more will what is permanent have glory.

The law was temporary, but the Spirit is permanent. The ministry of Moses keeps people blind and their hearts hard.


12Since we have such a hope, we are very bold, 13not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face so that the Israelites might not gaze at the outcome of what was being brought to an end. 14But their minds were hardened. For to this day, when they read the old covenant, that same veil remains unlifted, because only through Christ is it taken away. 15Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their hearts.

The ministry of the Spirit removes the veil. It removes the hardness. Spirit brings life! And where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is soul liberty!


16But when oned turns to the Lord, the veil is removed. 17Now the Lorde is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 18And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

Therefore I am not a minister of death by the studying and commendation of mankind through the studies of Moses. I do not want a certificate from mankind that tells that I am ‘qualified’ to minister life to people. Only Christ can qualify someone to bring life and freedom to people. Mankind’s institutions cannot ‘confirm’ you. Only Christ can confirm you by His Spirit. What He tells you will be confirmed by the living epistles, which are those who walk in life and love. When a person’s heart is prompted by His Spirit to confirm that a person has brought you life and freedom, say so. It doesn’t take a certificate printed on an inkjet printer by a 501c3 religious institution. It comes by way of His Spirit bearing record among the brethren.
But do not do so lightly, this is a matter of the Spirit. This is not a commendation that should be said flippantly, but after discernment that their hearts are filled with love and their ministry is one that brings life.
I shared this on my Facebook page and I want to include some of the additional comments my friends contributed to this:
Paul S: I don’t think a PhD in theology is necessary to make a contribution to the discusssion. Some formal education or it’s equlivalent is necessary to learn proper exegetical and expository technique and process, but it doesn’t need to be extensive for proclamation of the gospel and teaching.
That said the Apostle Paul had a formal education. He was a rabbi, that tells us he went to school from age 6-10 or 12 to learn Torah. He would then have moved on to the next phase to learn Tanahk. At 17 or 18 he was selected by Gamaliel to be his disciple. Gameliel was the grandson of the great rabbi Hillel. Paul was well educated prior to his conversion and his well developed theology demonstrates that.

David W: I do not think that a formal education at this point in time is going to help anyone who truly wishes to follow Jesus. Even the most conservative seminaries are full of the pride that leads people astray, into fruitless lives striving to build up a human institution, and missing the mark, in the process. I know several very promising people who were seriously misled by believing that their seminary professors knew what they were talking about. We are followers of Jesus, built up by His Spirit, chosen and sent out by Him. The last time I checked that does not require any extra credentials. We do not need the world to train “professionals” for us.

Philip H: Those in Bible colleges and seminaries Learn mans word! Here is God’s people!
1st cor.1,26-31 26For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: 27But God hath chos…en the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; 28And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: 29That no flesh should glory in his presence. 30But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: 31That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

Sisterlisa: Lets not forget that many of the disciples were simple fishermen. They probably had the basics of the Law down from their childhood years, but they did not attend Pharisee training like Paul did. And it took Priscilla (a woman) and her husband Aquilla, to ‘teach they way of Christ more perfectly’ to Apollos. A woman in their time…that’s impressive. And Lydia led her household of maidens in worship..another woman..not so sure either of these two women had formal training from the Pharisees.

None of us are ever going to have ‘doctrine’ or ‘theology’ 100% correct all the time. We are all on a journey and each of us have pieces to the grand puzzle. We need each other to put the pieces in place. God will guide us and we can learn and grow together in ‘Community’ and HIs Spirit guides us into all truth.

{John 16:13} When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.


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Filed Under: Organic Church

Finding Organic Church

August 2, 2010 By 3 Comments
I’ve been on a journey of discovering what many call Organic Church for several months now. I have attended different home fellowships and ‘church’ gatherings all while reading Frank Viola’s newest book, ‘Finding Organic Church‘. After coming out of legalism, I have been very skeptical of any ‘church’. I have come to a very different perspective on what church really is and means. The true ‘church’ is really called Ekklesia, which actually means ‘assembly’ in English. After many years of watching organized religion I don’t feel comfortable with what the world views as ‘the church’. After reading Frank’s book and keeping up with his blog, ‘Reimagining Church‘, I can see that he feels the same way. I personally prefer to say Ekklesia (on the largest scale) or Assembly, at times possibly Congregation, for those who are meeting locally.
In ‘Finding Organic Church’, I learned that there are things to look for when seeking an organic expression of the local Ekklesia. Frank shares his insight, from personal experience over 21 years on what he has seen, what he feels is uplifting, and what he has seen that has not been. While reading this book I did not feel as though he was being negative at all, just informative on what positive things to look for, while at the same time sharing what could potentially be destructive. He shares what he has discerned over the years and I have seen a lot of that, already, in the last few months.
As a book reviewer I want to let you know that I read this book while being on this very journey. Some reviewers might be reading and reviewing this book while remaining in the organized religion of man and find it either refreshing or offensive. I share my feelings about this book as one who is optimistic and on this same road. After coming out of organized religion, coupled with a strict form of legalism, I have more good, than objectionable, to say about ‘Finding Organic Church’. My review is candid and honest.
Frank presents his experience in four parts consisting of 24 different sections. Parts one and two are very refreshing to my soul. He guides you through what seemed to be the original expression of the local assemblies and how to look for those same characteristics in this modern world of religion. I echo him in saying, from my own words inspired from his writing, that when Christ lives in you and you are in him, he will manifest naturally in your life and in the local assembly. This Organic Church is a place where you should not see fake Christianity or any form of churchianity. However, no assembly is perfect. But Frank gives a clear representation of what it should look like. Even though he shares what characteristics to look for, always rely upon God’s Holy Spirit to give you the discernment you need in finding a local assembly to gather with for worship, prayer, study, and fellowship.
I want to be honest with you about section three. Frank shares practical helps in keeping your assembly organized and since I recently came out of an organized legalistic church I cringed through the entire section.  The effects of the organized religion I was in has left me still feeling rather battered. His ideas in this section seem to be coming from a heart that intends to share and give tips, but I personally feel that your local assembly needs to decide whether or not you want to apply them. I would imagine Frank would say the same thing, hopefully he’ll read this and clarify that part. I believe that as the assembly grows up together in Christ, that they will naturally follow the Lord’s leading in coming together with ideas for singing, child care, etc. So I think Frank is simply sharing tips based on what he has seen work and not work. (Frank, please forgive me for not being able to say much more about this section.)
The last section shares valuable information that I personally feel is vital that everyone, who seeks Organic Church, must read. I think it’s essential to guard yourselves and others from wolves and cult like leaders. After coming out of a cult I would never want to become involved in another one. I feel section four is of the utmost importance to read. I saw some pitfalls in that section that I have been guilty of when I first came out of organized religion. OUCH! (Frank, I received the correction) ;O)
Anyone who thinks they can get an organic church started without being in another established organic assembly for quiet some time first, must have a hole in their head. When you are looking for an assembly, be cautious! Don’t allow yourselves to get caught up in a situation where there is a ‘master of the meeting’ who calls all the shots. Humility and meekness should be an obvious and consistent characteristic of a healthy local Ekklesia.
I highly recommend Frank’s new book ‘Finding Organic Church’, even though he tells me ‘From Eternity to Here‘ is his best yet. (It’s on my wish list, by the way) I enjoy Frank’s books and his blog, but I’m sure he would agree with me that it’s not about the man, but the messages of keeping Christ in the center, that matters.
Other Links About Frank:
Frank on Twitter @FrankViola

Sisterlisa is a homeschooling mom of four children and married to a ministry leader of a Rescue mission. She is the owner of Growing in Grace Magazine and Pix-O-Sphere.

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Ask the Community

May 6, 2010 By Leave a Comment
by Sisterlisa
Sometimes we have questions that we are afraid to ask. Sometimes we need advice about something and the blanket statement answers just don’t cut it. Why do we not feel safe to get the help we need? Many religious leaders tend to give us the drive-thru fast food answers to a huge banquet style problem. It just doesn’t cut it. Maybe your questions are about scripture and your denomination doesn’t support you asking questions outside their box. I would like to extend to my readers the opportunity to ask anything in this forum. Without fear of being judged.
Maybe you love your fellowship, but you have questions you want to ask, that you know you’ll get judged for asking or even contemplating. I want you to know you can ask anything here. I don’t proclaim to have all the answers, but I know the one who does, Jesus. Not to say you don’t know him too. Just that sometimes it helps to bounce things off one another and hear out what other people have to say from what they have experienced with our Lord and Savior. Sometimes a fresh perspective helps us come to the conclusion HE wants for us to get. I believe it’s so important to allow ourselves to hear His voice…sometimes direct advice is not what we really need, but rather to hear someone out, but listen for His Spirit to speak to our hearts through those words from a brother or sister in Christ.
You can leave a question on this blog anonymously and I can post your question and hear out what our readers have to encourage you with. We have a wonderful online community of Believers that love the Lord and converse with you in the comment section.
The Body of Christ is a community. But this community is not just confined to your city or country, this Body is global. Being in touch with and building the online community through His Spirit is a powerful thing with grace and mercy. Sometimes it’s the only community we can feel the safest in. Safe to be you.

Bless you!

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What the Church Is

February 15, 2010 By Leave a Comment

by T. Austin-Sparks

What, then, is this spiritual house? What is this Church? Let us not have an objective mentality about this, thinking of it as something somewhere outside of and apart from ourselves. What is it? The answer is a very simple one. The spiritual house of God is Christ Himself. Yes, but not Christ personally alone, but Christ in you, in me, the hope of glory. Oh, it is just here that all the mistakes have been made about the Church, with such disastrous results. 
The Church, the House of God, is simply Christ Himself in undivided oneness found in all those in whom He really dwells. That is all. That is the Church. Seek to root out of your mentality any and every other idea of the Church. It is not Christ divided into a thousand or a million fragments amongst so many believers. It is still one Christ. You and I are not the Church. It is Christ in you and in me that is the Church. We still remain what we are outside of the Church still on our natural ground, but it is the measure of Christ in us that constitutes the Church, a spiritual Church, a spiritual house, the one Christ by the one Spirit in all those in whom He dwells. That is the Church. God has never seen in that Church, in that Temple, anything but His Son. 
He is the Temple of God and you and I can never belong to the Church save as Christ is in us. I know that is a simple thing to say, but if we would just fasten on that and see what that means; it is one of the great factors of unspeakably great power against the enemy, if only we would live on that basis, if only we would abide there.
There are two ways of approaching the matter, and I see again the great success of Satanic propaganda in this matter. I do not know what you older Christians think about it. We can only speak of what we have recognized in our lifetime, but we have lived long enough to recognize the course of things, and to me it does seem, and it more than seems, that, in the last few years, the last few decades, there has been a far greater development and growth of suspicion amongst Christians than there used to be, so that today it is almost impossible to speak anywhere without people wondering if you are quite sound. It is in the atmosphere.
 
It seems to me that there is a constant alertness to scent something that is not quite sound, and anything that is of God is prejudiced by that attitude, that state of things. The real truth of God is not getting a chance because this suspicion has spread over all the world, among all Christians. Is this quite right? Is this quite sound? Is this quite true? What is the snag here? What is the error in this? It is like that. That is the positive line, that has become the positive line, and, beloved, I believe that this is one of the marks of this Satanic propaganda to bring about collapse from the inside, because it means that there is internal disintegration, there is no cohesion, the people of God are broken up into thousands of fragments by this very spirit and atmosphere of suspicion bringing about prejudice, and the Church cannot move together as a solid whole. 
There are very few Christians indeed who can move a hundred percent together, as one, simply because of this. Satan brings it into the most intimate circles of Christian life and fellowship, all the time bringing up this horrible element of uncertainty, question. Yes, he has got into the inside, and he is bringing about internal disintegration and collapse in a very quiet way, but subtly working through the years, and he can win many bloodless battles along that line. He can take territory very easily along that line and hold it and gain his end of dominion.
Take another earthly expression of this spiritual background of things. Do you not see, beloved, that over there there is no room whatever for a second thought or a second mind? Anybody through the last seven years who has had another thought, another mind, a second idea, has been eliminated. You may not there have two minds. You have got to subjugate your mind to this other mind, this dominating mind. You must not have an opinion, you must not reason, you must not speak in any way that cuts across the prevailing mind, the mind of the dictator. There is no room for anything that is second. It is one. Satan knows the almost infinite value of oneness, and that is a secret of progress, of success; a ruthless, murderous elimination of every second voice, to have only one voice, one mind, one will, dominating all others. Dare you think otherwise? Dare you have a mind of your own? Well, have it, but make very sure that you never let it be known. That is the regime, and what power there is for the object in view!
Well now, that is an earthly expression of a spiritual system. Bring that into the realm of the Church. Why is the Church paralysed, weakened, held up? Why can it not go forward terrible as an army with banners? Because there has been this disintegrating work secretly going on within its borders, so that suspicion is the order of the day. I suggest to you that, for the sake of the overthrow of the Satanic kingdom which is to be brought about by and through the Church in union with its Head, its Lord, in glory, for the sake of that and unto that end, you and I should make the opposite our positive course. Let us not be forever suspiciously asking, what is wrong? What is doubtful? What is unsafe here? but positively, What is there of Christ in this? On that I fasten! What do I see or sense of the Lord Jesus in this matter? With that I engage, I co-operate. Oh, if we would only take that as our positive course, Satan would soon be losing ground, the Church would soon be coming up a glorious Church. One thing which characterised the Church at its beginning was oneness. They spoke the same things, they were all of one mind and one heart, and what ground the enemy lost! But, as soon as the enemy began his secret ‘fifth column’ work of propagating internal doubts, suspicions, prejudices, he very soon brought the Church down out of that realm of reigning life and scattered its power.
Oh, we must pray the Lord that the one Christ, the one Spirit, shall be in the ascendant in us! We shall not be living either upon the ground of what we are naturally – for we shall always be affected by what we are naturally, but upon the ground of what there is of Christ in one another; neither let us be dwelling upon the ground of possible error, possible false teaching, and possibility of it being there all the time and almost looking for that more than anything else. Oh, we must trust the Lord about this matter! I do believe, beloved, that the safest way, the way of our protection from error, is to go on with the Lord. Our position must be – I am going on with the Lord where I find the Lord, and I am going to trust the Lord in the matter of error, and, as we walk with the Lord, we shall sense, without looking for it, where the error is, and we shall be warned by the Spirit, we shall know. We must move on the positive basis, that of the Lord Himself, and that is glory in the Church, when it is the Lord. “Christ in you, the hope of glory.”
We know quite well, in simple ways, that this is true. We meet one another, we have never met before. We discover very quickly by our spiritual sense that we belong to the Lord, and then we have a very blessed time simply on that ground. We flow together because we are the Lord’s, and, if only we stood there, we would go on having a blessed time; but presently we begin to discuss some doctrine and find we do not agree. All the glory goes out, the fellowship breaks down. Oh, the Lord hold us into Himself!
Now, I am saying this spiritual house is Christ, and all that is not Christ has got to be kept in its own place, and we have got to seek to remain on the basis of Christ as in us and as in one another, and this is the glory of God, that we should be to the glory of His grace. That is where it begins – His grace. It seems to me, it has seemed to me through the years, (I do not know whether I am right in doctrine now or not, it is a forgivable mistake if it is error), but it has seemed to me through the years very often, that the Lord Himself has taken pains to keep me on the basis of grace, and by that I mean He has so often let me know in experience that, but for His grace, I am a lost man in experience, not a doctrine, not as truth. 
Oh, today, it would be a bad thing for me if it were not for the grace of God! Yes, to appeal even today to the Blood, to the grace of God, because of that precious Blood, today, after so many years of knowing the Lord! Yes, it is grace today, and it is that that brings glory to God, allowing us to know how base, how foul, we are, and letting us know that that makes no difference to Him because of the Blood. That is glory to God. I do not know what the deepest note in your heart is today, but that is the deepest note in my own heart after these years. Ah, it is the grace of God that is the glory of my heart, the glory of His grace. He is glorified by our recognition of His grace and our abiding on the basis of His grace. The glory is soon taken away from the Lord when we get on to any other ground; what we are and can do and what we are doing.
The Lord will very soon put a stake in our flesh when we begin to get exalted like that. He is being robbed of glory. He is glorified by our transfiguration, our conformity to the image of His Son. Paul says, “We… beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are transformed into the same image” (2 Cor. 3:18). The glory is connected with the change, transformed into the same image. He is glorified as we are changed into the image of His Son. He is glorified when our lives are becoming fruitful. “Herein is my Father glorified that ye bear much fruit” (John 15:8). And the fruit, in the first place, is the fruit of the nature of the Lord Jesus, the fruit of the Spirit, love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faith, meekness, self-control. “Herein is my Father glorified.” Fruit in service, of course, but fruit in life, and He is glorified by the endurance of the saints.
Ah, yes, let us lay this to heart as our final word. If only we recognized it. There is a great deal of glory brought to the Lord simply along the line of endurance. At times we can do no more. The only thing to do is to give up or to hold on; to let go, or to endure. Peter has a lot to say about that. “This is grace, if a man endure.” and just to endure brings glory to God. It will be a great story, it will be one of the large and glorious volumes in the library of heaven, the story of the endurance of the saints, how much glory it brought to God. 
Oh, the story will be a romance! How many people were influenced by it, how many unbelievers came to believe because of the endurance of some saint in the time of suffering! How many other saints were mightily supported as they saw the steadfast endurance of another under fiercest trial! How much the Lord got out of just sheer endurance! Yes, this is to the glory of God, if we endure. The Lord get glory in the Church by Christ Jesus unto all ages forever and ever, and may we indeed be a house for His glory in these various ways.

Excerpt from Chapter 2 of God’s Spiritual House by T. Austin-Sparks

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By Two or Three Witnesses

December 11, 2009 By Leave a Comment

by Sisterlisa

We hosted a poll over the past few weeks to see how many of you have suffered persecution. I admit we have no way of knowing where, those who voted, live. But the results show that persecution is inflicted upon people in a way that is difficult to prove, which also makes it difficult to stop. In the years of working with hurting men and women over the last decade, we have seen this cycle of mental abuse.

Most times the best way to relieve yourself from experiencing this kind of persecution is to abstain from contact with those abusive people. From our experience over the years we have seen that breaking away from someone who is abusive is because there is a relationship developed that is hard to break away from.

In the beginning we tend to overlook subtle abuse because we are ‘blinded by love’, as many victims of abuse call it. So, we overlook the abuse and we never speak up about how we feel. When we do that it makes it easier for the abusive ones to inflict more and take advantage of you more often. This is enabling. We love them, overlook the abuse, and enable them to continue being abusive. So, what do you do when it gets to a point where you are under such oppression, but feel so stuck in the relationship? (Please don’t misunderstand. I’m not spoeaking about marriage, that is another matter entirely.) I’m speaking about other types of relationships. Whether it’s a friend, a co-worker, or religious leader, etc.
We find ourselves in a real jam. If we stop putting up with it and voice our opinion they may retaliate against us or get angry at us speaking up about it. Hold it right there. If we suspect that their reaction will be taken as an offense then that may be a good indicator that we need distance from them, or perhaps we have misunderstood. In any event, the situation demands attention. Our Lord tells us in Matthew 18 that we are to find witnesses to help assist.
Matthew 18:16, “16But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.”
I had a discussion with my husband about this. Since Jesus told us that we need to get two or three witnesses to assist us in establishing a matter, then it is clearly evident to us that those two or three witnesses are bound by biblical command from Jesus, to assist. But when believers refuse to get involved, you continue to seek for help. By the time twenty to thirty people have refused to help you, word gets around and suddenly you’re labeled as a gossip. However, if the first three people would have responded to our Lord’s command to assist, then it may never have gotten around town to begin with.
  • I recommend you take time to pray before seeking the first few witnesses. You need to make sure they are strong individuals who seek to bring reconciliation to all involved and who can stand firm with everyone.
  • You may want to explain the situation before you inform them of who it involves.
  • Be in prayer together as a group before coming together for a meeting with the individual(s).
  • Be willing to be corrected if you have done wrong as well.
If you are ever approached by someone who needs your assistance in mediating a situation, take it seriously. Please do not deny helping those who need you. If you honestly feel that you won’t be able to help them, then at least help them find someone who can. But please do not leave them hanging.



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